UK
Are London’s quants pricing themselves out of the market?
One senior financial services consultant says the price of a good quant in the City of London is so high that some non-French banks have started shifting quant teams out of London and into Paris.
“The price of a quant has risen so much that some firms have shifted quant teams to Continental Europe, where mathematical skills come more readily – and are cheaper,” he tells us.
French quants are certainly far cheaper than their UK counterparts. While a fresh-faced PhD can now command a 59k base salary plus a 59k bonus by joining a top US bank in the City, his counterpart in Paris is earning a salary of 40k to 55k, plus bonus of 50% to 100%, according to recruitment firm Robert Walters.
The discrepancy increases with time. After five years, a quant in London will be on around 400k, while his or her Paris counterpart will have to scrape by on no more than 170k.
“Quants are twice as cheap in France,” says Antoine Morgaut, director of Robert Walters’ Paris office. “If I were running a quant desk I’d put it here – it’s cheaper and easier to develop a team.”
Morgaut confirms that some US banks are looking to grow French quant teams – to the possible detriment of their London counterparts. However, Rachel Biernacka, head of the quant desk at recruitment firm Huxley Associates, disputes this: “If anything, everyone’s trying to centralise their exotic quant space in London,” she says.
Biernacka confirms that quants are getting pricier, however: “Because they’re an integral part of the business with the structurers and traders, they now have a direct line to the bonus pool.”
If London quants get too costly, Parisian rivals may not be the only ones vying for banks’ attention. “Mumbai is another alternative,” says Morgaut. “Quants are even cheaper there.”
That article is rubbish. A quant with 5 years experience doesn’t earn 400K ,but something like 200K, and a quant in paris doesn’t earn that much either…I don’t know where people get information….
Anyway companies like to outsource , and I feel in a few years most companies will be based in India and Africa ,and all migrants will stay home.
Anon: the figures come from recruitment agents, who have a vested interest in boosting figures to mythical levels. I knew a senior phd qualified quant working on an equities desk who was getting less than 100k sterling, total comp.
I don’t agree with the quant getting a mil. Maybe a few at the top end, as most jobs are advertised with 70k base going upto 150k for senior guys. Even with a bonus 1 mil is a bit steep…
First, you can’t keep these very few expensive quants away from the front office. Thus, if you want to move the very few well-paid quant jobs you have to consider moving the whole front office altogether.
Second, the overheads are much higher in France than in the UK. Therefore, the savings on cheaper salaries are likely to evaporate through higher charges.
Totally agree with the others – the figures are blown up by HHs and are unrealistic. The big names earn large amounts but these guys are few.
This report is an absolute pile of bull.
By all means, quants are overworked and underpaid with no glamour. Take about 2 zeroes from that 1m pounds. I-bankers – yes overworked and underpaid definitely.
I do agree that some of the quant work would get moved to cheaper locations. But this will take time, say 5 – 10 years.
Someone commented that Mumbai is cheaper than Paris – why of course, and certainly there are places cheaper than Mumbai.
But the question should also be: why is it cheap? As of today you still cannot find a critical mass of qualified quants in these places, quants are still flocking to london – by qualified I mean someone who has a very strong hold over math, understanding of derivatives, and also some computing. It is rather easy to find people good at one of these three things but not all. Anyone who is good and is mobile can relocate to London.
This is a well balanced article. Not. This is a French based consultant talking about jobs in Paris. Instead of making himself look stupid talking about mythical salaries he should instead ask himself why France’s best is working in London. And from what he is saying he clearly has never been near a trading floor let alone worked on one. And for the record I would love to work in France.
It’s the first time I heard that overheads are cheaper in France than in London. Does this guy know how much companies are taxed in France? Even if they pay a bit less, they will pay twice more taxes.. So they have no interest in sending people in France… Ridiculous… And for the record I know a 6y Quant in credit who earns a base of 100k.
Guys, all very interesting, you right the salaries indicated by Robert Walters and the others are hugely inflated, however the salaries are on the way-up, especially in Asia and the M.E. The quant’s that are laughing at the moment in Asia are PhD Commodity quant’s and your EQD quant’s. Just recently I moved a director level commodity quant to Singapore to join a global European bank, total comp is GBP450K. Over the past 9 months I moved 15 quant’s globally and I can guarantee you no ones salaries are at the levels these firms were suggesting.
They are speculating and pulling numbers out the air, but really has no working knowledge of the markets within the quant world. It’s a shame that some of the larger “head hunting” firms only publish these articles for publicity and to meet quarterly KPI’s!, instead of current and accurate information for the benefit of the candidates and employers. There is a big push for quants in the M.E. and Asia but I can guarantee you it’s certainly not going to be France.
All said!