UK
As the ex-banker turned security guard who is writing for us today makes clear, the longer you’re out of the market, the harder it is to get back in again.
After being out for six months, he spoke to one recruiter who told him his skills had atrophied to such an extent that he was unemployable compared to people let go more recently.
True? Or false? If you lost your financial services job in late 2009, what are the chances of being reemployed in a similar capacity when conditions improve?
If you were let go a long time ago, it stands to reason that you will be lower calibre than someone let go more recently. Jobs will always go to those who’ve been out for the shortest amount of time. Sad, but true.
There is a direct correlation between gaps in cv and likelyhood of re-entry. The longer the gap, the bigger the barrier to getting an interview. It’s not always fair to draw the conclusions that Roving Roger has, however it’s the way many hiring managers look at it. The moral of the story is that if you find yourself out of market the best policy is to treat day one of your job search as if it were day 100. It will be that way for a while yet, regardless of what Mr Soros has to say about recovery.
Recruiters saythat if you do nothing while looking for a job, you won’t be able to get back in. But they also say that if you take a job outside of your previous area, you won’t be able to get back in. So then how do you fill the CV gap? I emailed one HH to say I’ve found a new job – which pays as well as the old one and has great growth potential, still in financial services – and was told that I was destroying my chances of getting back to what I’d done before. What kind of advice is that?? Other than the HH realizing there is no chance she’ll be making commission from placing me in a role.
I think the solution is just to find another job that compensates you appropriately for your skill level. Banks and the recruiters that they use are fickle, often ill-informed, and most importantly they do not have YOUR best interests in mind. We have no idea when hiring will return, and if it does, we also don’t know if the job will still be as desirable as it was when we started it. Think about your life and career and stop clinging to the good old days.
I was out for 5 years post 9/11 – long story – some very b”"tchy ex colleagues sticking the knife into me at every opportunity to make sure I didn’t get back in as I had just come back from NYC – equity research is a small place – What did I do? I went away and built my own business – consultancy primarily -I started looking again in summer 07 when my business was cooling down and got back in and still here!
It is difficult to be in that situation because of the constant negativity from HHs- you really start to doubt yourself. But it can be done – I am living proof -all you need is one job after all! So yes you can get back in after 5 years!! never mind 6 months.
What about further study. You have been out of work and have been studying towards a qualification (i.e degree, cima/aca), how are you viewed in the job market.
Secondly, as many companies now are hiring on a six month rolling basis, there may well be a gap in your CV when re-entering the job market
a)Tell porkies. Say you went traveling and enjoyed your redundancy on a beach in Greece for 2 months. As long as you have a few colleagues who’ll vouch for you, you’ll be grand.
b) Skills atrophied is claptrap unless you’ve forgotten how to use email and a phone.
c) As usafaerie says, don’t assume the future will be very much like the past.
Recruiters are only reflecting back what their clients are saying – don’t blame them. If you are out of market now be prepared to take a compromise in what you do next. Obviously flipping burgers whilst you out will not help you get that dream job on the trading floor. Likewise being fussy about what you are prepared to interview for is a quick route to failure whilst hiring managers have a negative sentiment. If you are unlucky enough to be out of market you should be prepared to work harder for less money as well as be prepared to do less glamourous functions. Staying in the game will be the best way to enjoying success further down the line. From this recruiters view point there are still lots of Prima Donnas out there who don’t appreciate the world beyond their own ego. If you have an axe to grind then recrutiers are likely to loose interest in you very quickly. Remember that the financial services industry as well as the human beings that recruit for it don’t owe you anything. If you want someone to blame then look at the person you shortlisted you for redundancy and look no further.
One of the most expensive mistakes I ever made was to believe what I was told by a recruitment consultant. I’m sure there are some good ones out there, but most of the ones I have met are very poor. As the skills you need in the City are rudimentary compared with most other professions, I don’t see how they can atrophy. That said, you probably are less employable with a longer gap in your CV, because the berks you are selling yourself to believe this nonsense.
Recruiters are full of crap. They try and be nice to you to get more information out of you as to who is hiring and then they call them up – thus adding more potential clients that are competition for you. Apply direct, thats what the firms are doing. Cut out these greedy people.
Employment success depends more on the preferences of the hiring manager(s) than the merits of the candidate.
The attitude of most people in the City is short-term, narrow-minded, self-interested and bigotted. Finance filters out these personality traits.
So gaps do decrease your employment prospects. Agents look at people en masse so they view gaps very negatively because it decreases their chances of a sale.
Consequently, it will be harder to find a job with a gap, and you need to decide whether it is worthwhile taking the chance that it will lead to nought.
I find some of the comments re recruiters incredible. They have a job to do and fundamentally the outcomes of their role is to gain access to the right type of vacancies and find the right type of people to fill them. This benefits the company with the vacancy, the succesful candidate and the recruiter. Those who lose out are the one’s who were not good enough to get the position.
However, they benefit in that they are now with a recruiter who will continually keep an eye on the market for them, whereas if you apply directly to a job and don’t get it there is no backup plan apart from finding another role to apply directly to – not easy considering the number agreements these days between companies and recruiters.
To summarise – they wouldn’t not represent you if you had a good chance of getting the position. It just isn’t in their interests. Profit margin has to be considered!
hedge me.
bitter much?
Been out a few months and set my own investment advisory company up – problem is now I’m actually already generated in commission what I made in nearly a years salary as a senior associate at a leading Investment Bank in Canary Wharf when I was employed – since profits go directly to yourself and small team, unlike in corporate world.
Been out of market is fine as long as what you doing is productive – my 5 years of experience is not going to be forgotten just for been out 3 months or even 6 months. Biggest problem I have is convincing new employers that as my business is doing so well and generating good capital that I want to enter the corporate world again (obviously leaving this business running on the side – without letting them know that) so usually have to downplay the success of it – at the end of the day, this is a major benefit to future employers as buildings my investor client base!
Best advice: Use your new time if you have been made redundant to do something very constructive you wanted to do but could not well employed full time in the financial markets.
It does not stand to reason you are lower calibre – My company simply closed for business due to the parent company’s financial situation – everyone went so no reflection on any of us. However, anyone madde redundant at the start of this recession will have a greater chance of being out for longer because there has been very little hiring since Q3 08.
It is this sort of narrow minded stupidity which wastes the talents of perfectly good people who simply happened to have some bad luck. The effect on morale of comments like this is destructive and corrosive and encourages the false arrogance of those who just happen to be lucky.
This has nothing to do with a meritocracy but merely bolsters the egos of the lucky and further destroys the lives of the unlucky.
Life is not meant to be fair but ensuring those who suffer misfortune have no chance of reviving their fortunes through hard work and resilience is counter productive. They may be the very people who have the drive, resilience and resourcefulness to survive adversity and the common prejudice is ensuring their talents and potential contributions are wasted.
No, I don’t think it’s true. Firstly, you can be out of work for about six months (following redundancy), like me, simply by choice. I had the money to support myself and took the time to retrain and diversify my computer skills. Then I took a short-term contract in a completely unrelated environment/profession, before becoming unemployed again. All this talk of getting in and out again implies that companies and employees are set in stone about how they operate. They no longer are. Large numbers of people are freelance or contract workers with no intention of tying themselves to a single company or even profession. People don’t work for 25 years in the same place any more and then get a gold clock. They may have several careers over time. In my experience, if you can do the job and sell yourself well, you can always get back in, or get into something completely different for the first time. I’m 45 years old and have been turning down work which isn’t related to my main career (journalism) to boot. I do what Darwin suggested for survival – and that’s to adapt. And don’t rely on recruitment conultancies. Of course they have their own agengas. Approach future employers yourself.
As a headhunter, this guy has been told utter drivel. Nobody’s skills are going to ‘atrophy’ over six months – people come back to their jobs after career breaks, maternity etc years afterwards (seven years anyone?). This is just code for ‘we are not desperate enough for staff at the moment’. Long-term unemployment is certainly to be avoided, but more for reasons of morale than anything else – also if someone is long-term unemployed they are expected to have found something, anything, to do if they are any good. As for not being able to come back in, that is tosh as well – everyone understands that the best professionals cannot control market conditions and sometimes have to make career decisions which are not what they would want in a non-existent ideal world. Of course, this can be a good out to say no to a candidate of whose calibre you are unconvinced – but I would say that noone needs to be seriously worried that they have been doing something other than their chosen business for at least two years, by which time even the worst recession should show signs of lifting. (Of course, if things improve and you don’t go back immediately, questions will be asked eventually).
It is possble to get back in after a gap but perserverence is key.
I was out for 15 months in the last downturn and got back in but make no mistake, life adjustments are needed & it’s character building for most if you adjust your mindset. Re recruitement consultants, personally, I use a select few only and have consistently seen the so called big names being very much churn & & burn merchants. Another true example, I was once sent a spec for a pure programming role and the consultant then called me for the required green light. I’m in the business-line so I asked him where exactly on my CV it says that I’m a cobol programmer?? his response “well you’ve used a lot of systems so I thought it was worth a try”! Pathetic, so told him to learn to read & to stop wasting both mine & his own time then hung up, Frankly, I rate most consultants as much as I rate estate-agents, nuff said, no industry accreditation and many failed City wannabees end up in recruitement where they have no clue on the internal process’s at the banks etc. Make your own moves and network is my advice, never failed me yet.
Forget recruiter advice. After having worked with my share of the trade over the last 5 years in the city, I can honestly say: I trust a recruiter’s advice as much as a Russian car sales man in New Jersey. And believe me, I have worked with heads of the top executive agencies and with Joe Block Financial Recruitment shop one man band Ltd. Neither of them is in the business to give anyone advice. They are selling bodies and most of them would sell their grandmother to Goldmans if they can get a nice commission for it. So, forget what a recruiter says. Most of them dont know the difference between car loans and leveraged loans or between asset management and asset servicing. Anyone can get back into the market, even after 1-2 years if they prove they will add value. The key is to stay in touch with your market, either through pro-bono work or by opening your own consulting/advisory business. Forget the size of your pay-check for a while and do not let HHs discourage you!!! Most of them have no clue!
6 months out and you certainly can get back in – however, like our overseas brethren, you will have to be cheap.